Page 3 - TEFL Madrid

TEFL: (Chuvinh) Saying it is ‘ridiculous’ is too harsh of a word, I admit, but I guess what I really want to come across as saying is that it is ... limited. And that isn't saying much either as it is nothing new, but teaching IS tough, and it isn't anything we can just be taught to do. It is an art, but only for those with the desire to do it better.

  

If you put it that way, yeah, as an academy owner, I would want a person to have a TEFL just as saying I would want a person to have at least a university degree to work for me in anything else. I received my TEFL two or three years ago, but after having had some experience teaching already and learning a second language. I didn't feel I gained much from TEFL as a result, and perhaps that's where I'm coming off a bit abrasive towards the TEFL or any other teacher trainings in general. If anything, I think one of the best attributes a person can have in succeeding as a second language teacher is having learned a second language, and that in itself speaks volumes. Upon further reflections of the things I did in my TEFL courses, I definitely would say that there are things in the course that are necessary for all English teachers. I just hope people investing money to be trained in this don't expect it to completely prepare them for most everything they will encounter in a real situation.

I think this sums it up: On TEFL training and teaching: ... it is ... limited. ... teaching IS tough, and it isn't anything we can just be taught to do. It is an art, but only for those with the desire to do it better. I wholeheartedly agree. I also agree that there's no way anyone is going to "really" learn how to be a teacher until they've been through a year of "hell" with a hellish class or classes, or boss.

I don't want to sound like a big TEFL fan or anything, but I really do think it's worthwhile. If I didn't, I wouldn't have spent 400 euros to go down to Seville last weekend, and I sure as heck wouldn't even consider doing the DELTA, but I am. I don't know exactly when yet, but I'm shooting for the summer of 2006 or 2007. I think it's at least 2,500 euros to get into the course, plus lost working hours (perhaps over 5,000 to 6,000 euros for me). That's a mightly big expense, but I do notice that as I improve my methods and techniques it does get easier to keep my clients happy and paying. I'm absolutely convinced that there's a direct corrollation between my improving my teaching both with and without training (i.e. "on my own," which you can see from my website is around 95%) and my being able to get and keep these guys (basically speaking: even if they would have paid a company the same as me, I think they have usually expected more from me than they would have from a teacher / traveller who was getting a fraction of what they would have paid the company.) For me as a freelancer, getting in is only half the job, the other half is keeping them.

TEFL, DELTA: (Chuvinh) Without having really read into what the DELTA is, how is this diploma much different than the TEFL? I can see your reasons to invest in this program. I guess the main thing that runs through my head after I had taken the TEFL is simply that every form or manner in teaching English is valid, and it should definitely not be limited to only one or a few methods in guiding students. If anything, with an open mind, it never hurts to review some of the things you learned and even better, pick up practical ideas to use with your groups. More than anything, finding the practical things that work, varied and keep students interested are always a challenge. Reflection is very important, and if you can find more people who are willing to share in a forum like this, then we would have something pretty valuable going on in the web. That is, people who are willing to contribute and truly reflect rather than vent their frustrations on frivolous matters. Client retention I imagine, IS a task in itself. What can you do other than professional development? Other than the actual teaching itself, doesn't it really come down to whether they like you or they don't? What do you say to them to deflect such publicized forms of learning through flashy agencies who claim to have the best teachers and methods to learn English, and are they convinced?

I think you have to use different ways of teaching in guiding students at different times and for different needs. For example, sometimes they'll just want to talk so you'll have to have a set of techniques to help them get the most out of it like reformulating, on-the-fly correcting (so as to interrupt the flow minimally), etc. (You can also use some listenings, readings and photos to kick off a conversation or vice-versa.) Sometimes, they'll want "grammar" which means more than just explanations; it means practicing that grammar in some way such as in games so that they'll actually incorporate it into their repertoire. Sometimes, you'll see that they need some functional / situational language.

such as language for shopping or ordering in restaraunts and such so you'll need another way to target that like listening to and repeating dialogs and then practicing them in role plays. Basically, for different needs, different techniques and activities. Also, I don't want to slavishly adhere to just one technique because I can see that the students need change and change fosters memorability .... if you can find more people who are willing

to share in a forum like this, then we would have something pretty valuable going on in the web. That is, people who are willing to contribute and truly reflect rather than vent their frustrations on frivolous matters. Yep! I haven't had enough time to really check out the other forums on the internet, but I'm sure there's plenty going on if you can filter out "noise".

Client retention I imagine, IS a task in itself. What can you do other than professional development? => Teach 'em, entertain 'em and schmooze 'em. (i.e. give them what they paid for and more). Other than the actual teaching itself, doesn't it really come down to whether they like you or they don't? Yep! But, they'll like you more if they're getting what they want, whatever that is for a particular group or individual. What do you say to them to deflect such publicized forms of learning through flashy agencies who claim to have the best teachers and methods to learn English, and are they convinced? I used to try to deflect it somewhat. Now, I just respect the students' opinions or decisions, whatever those might be and stick to my teaching. They may be right for all I know, but usually they aren't. For example, there was a period of time that a lot of my students were talking about Vaughan Radio (a local English agency's marketing ploy), but I didn't lose a single one of them. With time, they themselves were telling me that it is was boring and repetitive and that they beat the marketing drums too much. Also, everybody here is used to academies and agencies claiming the best teachers and methods, but nobody really believes it. It IS marketing after all. The last big marketing ploy to work here was the MCmultimedia academy's of Wall Street Institute" and "Opening", etc. There was a huge "funny-money" scandal and around 200 academies closed within a year or two. Obviously, there's a sucker born every minute and there'll be plenty more to come, but there's plenty of weary and leery clients out there who will never consider an agency first and who will always try to find their teachers themselves. (It's a fact!) (Steve)

I'm a 22 year old Irish girl working as a journalist for the past three and a half years. Am looking for a bit of a career change / break and am interested in moving to Spain to teach English. Now, nothing strange about that, but have no idea where the best place to start out is, as I would be moving over on my own. Is it possible to get a decent teaching job without having TEFL? Can anyone offer some general advice on such a move or been in a similar situation? Hoping you can help Cheers Shaz
Steve: A decent teaching job!?! What's that? Are you talking about money-wise? There are very few around and it takes a long time to work into one. Rather, usually it's not just one but several "jobs" here and there if you want decent pay. The best entry level jobs go to people who have a good University level education and a CELTA certification or have useful experience in other areas like business or legal stuff (English for special purposes). However, at the risk of sounding sexist (excuse the Sociologist in me) I think there's an excellent market for young and beautiful teachers here. (In fact, when it comes to working face-to-face with people, I'm sure young and beautiful does well in everthing.) So that good looking trumps well prepared just about every time going in... (So, if you are beautiful, ignore everything else I've said and come on over ... to Madrid, that is ...) So, again, I should just say: "it depends" and leave it at that or I could say that "you should consider your strengths and weaknesses and focus on searching for the types of jobs that fit your profile." Of course, that's the sort of answer you would expect on a site like this ... but, I wouldn't want to get too predictable.

Preparing to come to Madrid: What can be done in advance, if anything, to make the transition smoother once in Madrid? I'll be looking for teaching jobs, have no certification, but 3 years experience in states--will it be harder w/out certification? Will it do any good to send CV out in advance of arrival? What is it like finding housing--will I need 3 months rent up front and verifiable employment? Any info/advice greatly appreciated.
Smooth transition?: money, time and preparation. Then again ... with money you've got it all. Experience vs. Certification?: I think 3 years of experience trumps a one month certification course, but who knows? You might find some genius out there that thinks a one month course is better than 3 years of the real thing ... Sending CV in advance do any good?: Heck, it can't hurt none ... You can always try to fool them into thinking you’re here already. Though, wouldn't it be silly if the CVs got here after you ...? I suspect you'll be sending them by e-mail, won't you? Rent: I don't know too much about it, but I think you might try looking to room with a family or with some other guys (or girls). It all depends on how long you're going to stay, but knowing the way some people are around here, you'd be lucky to get your deposit back. Hope it helps and good luck!!!

Come here comfortable so that you never find yourself in dire need of a job. That way you can take your time and choose. As far as the apartment, you can most likely find a place that is already lived in and has an extra room to rent, in which case you probably won't have to pay any rent upfront - maybe your part of a safety deposit - if there's three of you, your third, but you can probably find a room without much trouble. Now, if you want to rent your own place or you want to be the one who signs the lease, then you usually need to show that you have or make money and you usually have to put some sort of safety deposit down - I was just apartment hunting in the spring and I've found everything from a year or six months safety deposit (needless to say, I said "no way Jose") or one month safety plus the first month's rent, or some didn't ask for anything. If you do pay a deposit, you would be wise to put it in a joint account with the person and have it included in the lease and stated that the money is to be given back to you upon your leaving the apt. if everything is in order. To make your life simple at first, I would just rent a room from someone who is already on the lease. Look at the "Segunda Mano" website - it's a classified ad newspaper - and www.in-madrid.com - I think that's the address of In Madrid - an english speaking newspaper in Madrid which has some ads for rooms. Good Luck

CELTA / DELTA / Trinity Cert / Dip: The CELTA and Trinity Cert are equally accepted by language schools. The DELTA is done either a couple of years after doing the CELTA and working full time, or by experience teachers who might not have a CELTA/cert but are accepted on the course. It is much more demanding (in terms of what you are expected to do and the standard of teaching required) than the CELTA.

The British Council YL centre in Madrid decided to train up its teachers to Diploma standard, and so did an in-house Trinity Diploma. The reason for this was because, as a YL centre, a DELTA (=teaching adults) was not appropriate. The Trinity Diploma allows you to be observed teaching either YLs or adults and was deemed more appropriate. (I don't know who posted this.)